There IS a middle ground! Or is it a higher ground? Walking in the freedom of Jesus Christ… seems higher to me.

http://www.lalecheleague.org/NB/NBMayJun05p94.html
http://www.lalecheleague.org/NB/NBparenting.html
http://www.gentlechristianmothers.com/topics/gentlediscipline.php
http://www.playfulparenting.com/ (book: Larry Cohen’s Playful Parenting)
http://www.gordonneufeld.com/ (book: Gordon Neufeld’s Hold On To Your Kids)
http://fabermazlish.com/ (book: Adele Faber’s How To Talk So Your Kids Will Listen)
http://www.kidsareworthit.com/ (Barbara Coloroso’s, The Bully, The Bullied and the Bystander)
http://www.samalin.com/ (books: Nancy Samalin’s Love and Anger, Love and Anger, Loving Without Spoiling, Loving Each One Best)
http://www.askdrsears.com/html/6/T060100.asp
http://www.familyandhome.org/features/diff_child.html
http://www.parentchildhelp.com/SpiritedChild/tabid/59/Default.aspx
http://www.parentchildhelp.com/PowerStruggles/tabid/66/Default.aspx
The Shelter of Each Other: Rebuilding Our Families by Mary Pipher – http://www.marypipher.net/books.html

Where in the Bible does God hit any of his children?

Grace and peace,
TulipGirl

First I point out a few things:
1. I do not know of GKGW or TTUAC.
2. I have met children of rigid homeschooling families and for all I know they used one of those programs–I have met homeschooled kids who are eerie in their eagerness to say, do, and think “right” things, with little or no comprehension in evidence.
3. I have been homeschooled (though not unschooled) and corporally punished.

I agree that some people practice a new law of punishment that is thought to produce godliness, who codify the gospel with the help of a new Oral Law, and look to that law for righteousness rather than God.

And of course I certainly agree that corporal punishment can easily become abuse.

Nevertheless, I believe that corporal punishment is a proper method of discipline for Christian parents. Lisa mentioned the “turn your other cheek” teaching of Jesus (and I am not trying to criticize her personally, many people say the same) and asked how we could teach that and hit our children.

Turning the other cheek is about resopnding to people who are wronging you. If you are hitting your child because you personally feel offended or wronged, you are certainly doing the wrong thing.

Others pointed out that “system” should not be applied to people. I think I agree, although that is a little too vague to be sure… let me say it in my own words. Punishment should not be used to control children. Some people even try hitting their grown children to achieve their will–quite futile, and beyond what even most strict corporal punishment advocates usually suggest. As a child grows he or she must be allowed to experience the natural consequences of his or her actions. As Lisa pointed out, corporal punishment is not a typical consequence (at least, we would like to hope so).

Corporal punishment should not be about “consequences” or “control.” Yes, the punishment is a consequence of the misbehavior, and yes, corporal punishment can be appropriate for disobedience. But the goal of the punishment is not to cohercively control or train in Pavlovian fashion; it is to morally teach.

I mentioned that I thought “turning the other cheek” applied to offense against oneself, so that it could be taught while still disciplining a child. In a sort of contrasting example, I think that corporal punishment is an important way to teach a child that “the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all unrighteousness.”

We childern of God are punished by God for our disobedience in ways that are more painful than any spanking should ever be. The affliction of the soul that the psalmist writes about, which I have tasted of, lasts far longer than the sting from a spanking (which I have felt). The spankings that we give our children should not reflect our momentary outrage, but our constant and timeless belief that God hates sin. Lying and rebelliousness (stubborn and spiteful disobedience) are two examples of things for which the children of God have been punished very severely by God (the former quite explicitly in the New Testament).

Our punishment, then, is not meant to repay the child for the infraction. God’s penalty for these sins is death. We provide the merest shadow of that punishment, in hope of turning the child back before the sin becomes entrenched. While a more severe punishment might be appropriate for a repeat offense on a small scale, generally escalating punishment for habitual infractions misses the point that God has one penalty for sin.

Lisa is right that in our adult lives we usually aren’t struck for bad behavior. In fact we can very easily get away with a lot of unethical and immoral behavior without any punishment at all. The wicked sometimes live their entire lives without getting the due penalty for their ways. Thus the “real world” or the “consequences” is not what we are trying to teach our children, but the fear of God–the fear that caused Isaiah and Ezekiel and John (NT) to fall down before his holiness.

We must also teach the love of God, so that the repentant child is welcomed with open arms, and even the wayward child is protected from grievious harm.

I was never afraid of being hit by my parents unless I knew I had done wrong. I had been warned ahead of time that my behavior would result in a spanking. Having done what was wrong, I was afraid; and that is right. A child who is afraid because he does not know what he might be punished for next has not been disciplined rightly at all. But we should be afraid of the chastisement God will bring if we sin.

Certain relatives have said within one conversation how they would never spank their children and remarked on how well-behaved the childern of my father are. We are not brainwashed automatons. Yes, I know that anyone can and would say that, and you will pretty much have to take my word for it; I don’t want to divulge the personal stories that would substantiate it. Generally people regard us as smart, well-behaved, happy children, and we are.

This does not mean that children must be spanked to turn out happy, well-behaved, or smart. There are indeed people who are gentle, who evidently never harm another, and who have not been and/or do not believe in spanking. I believe that such people will always have a harder time understand the full awfulness of the punishment God has in store for the ungodly, or at least how such a punishment could come from a loving God. Good social behavior does not necessarily mean a true heart of humility and obedience before God, the ruling and reigning God over this present creation.

Interestingly enough in light of some of the preceeding comments, I went to a secular university. I did not go astray in what I take to be the sense of the earlier remark, but the thing I regret the most involved in part not listening to what my father and brothers advised. (Advised, not demanded; for my father always taught that you must do what the Holy Spirit convicts you to do through your conscience. Doing something without believing for yourself it is right is “sacrifice without obedience.”)

I believe that the God who was willingly crucified for our sins is the same God who specifically told the Israelites to kill man, woman, and child, and I believe it is Christ himself who will judge and punish the world at his second coming. I do not believe that children born to Christian parents have any sort of presumptive grace, any kind of free pass to heaven until the age of accountablity. If I believed differently, I might have a different view on corporal punishment. If you believe differently, I expect you to disagree about corporal punishment.

As I said, I think you guys have pretty much made up your minds on the issue and I am not trying to convert you. For the record, I thought I would contribute a first-hand account of corporal punishment, notwithstanding that you seem to have found some really misguided examples out there.

We met the local school district’s cirriculum requirements but behind the scenes we had a pretty relaxed school system. I am the only one to attend a college full time; so far the two ahead and two behind have found other avenues for pursuing their interests.

It was fun to find your site.

Arlan Purdy